Emphasis of course is mine. I've included time stamps in parenthesis within the dialogue when the dialogue was long and one wanted to get to the particular sentence. On the rare occasion when a word was unclear, I noted in it in brackets.
17:57 "And yet people will hold me accountable for the Westboro Baptist church people and things like that. And I’m like wait a minute. That’s not my life. That’s not how I approach people. That’s not my perspective. I do not want to be painted with that brush. I demand the right of self definition of what my faith is. We all demand that right. And yet for many Christians we refuse that right to Muslims."
White: Speaking of complicated, um,our worldviews—you, you mentioned to me that, that one of your frustrations is that, um, our worldviews share much more in common in regards to how they impact social issues, governmental issues, things like that, then many of the Christians that are willing to talk with you and yet they have a liberal, almost secular worldview when it comes to those things. And the very people that you should have the most in common with, there tends to be, the, the greatest amount of distrust.(1:11:08) Where do our worldviews intersect? I mean, for example, one of the things I mentioned to you and I just mentioned moments ago is, I’ve done a fair amount of written books, called “The Same Sex Controversy”, I’ve done a number of debates on the subject of homosexuality. I understand that homosexuality is considered to be a grave sin , uh within, uh, Islamic uh, theology. And from a Christian perspective, it is particularly grave because it is based on upon, uh, a, a rebellion against God’s right to define what is appropriate sexual behavior, what is a male, what is a female. The whole transgender movement is, uh, a rejection of God’s right to say this is male, this is female, this is what is good for male and female, etcetera. (1:11:57) So we have, where, where are the areas of intersection and does that mean there’s grounds for cooperation when people are trying to shove a particular worldview down our children’s throats basically?
Very good question. And this is really one of my main reasons for wanting to dialogue with uh, uh,uh Christians who are committed to the values of classical, mainstream Christianity. Because the fact of the matter is that yes, we have a lot of disagreements, but we have a lot in common with one another; in terms of morality, in terms of decency, in terms of family values. Committed Muslims and committed Christians really are seeing eye to eye. We both decry the, the, the liberalism, the secularization, the sexualization of our society; we both mourn over the loss of the family structure; we both want the man to be the man, the woman to be the woman, and one of the verses of the quran [unintelligible] God says, uh, the man is not like the woman, and yet in another verse, uh it mentions that, you know, uh you know, uh, God who created you from a man and a woman and from the two of them, he created multitudes of men and women. There is no third gender or [unintelligible] or transgender for us as Muslim and as many committed Christians, a man is a man, a woman is a woman, and there is no competition between the two genders. It’s not as if there’s any type of wrestling match going on and one has to prove the identity of other. God honors men and God honors women and for a man to be a man, and a woman to be a woman, is their honor. There is no competition in, against each other. A family unit is building block of society and when family is preserved, society is preserved. So in Islam, yes marriages are supposed to flourish and you’re supposed to have uh, a man and a woman, you know, have children together. We don’t uh, espouse or agree with these alternative ideologies and we do feel that, uh, they are simply not the norm that God created mankind upon. Uh, we also are very, you know, uh, sad at these changes that have taken place; the Supreme Court ruling, the what-not. I gave a sermon and lecture about this on line, I don’t know if you listened to it or not. In it we clearly said that even if it’s politically incorrect to say, as a Muslim I have to say this, that I don’t view this as being healthy for society; that these types of changes going on and are becoming normative and, and legal, and you know, (1:14:26) IF committed Christians and Muslims come had together; IF we had joined hands and forces, maybe we could have affected a stronger change?
White: I’ve never asked this question of Muslims before, so I never even thought of it, so here it goes. It could be dangerous, but from my perspective, I believe that God’s wrath abides upon a nation that flouts his law; that literally knowing what his law is, rejects that law and in essence spits in his face, from a Christian perspective, I think there’s plenty of evidence in the Old Testament that God’s wrath will come upon a people who consistently reject his way. What’s the Muslim perspective? Uh, your, your understanding?
Qadhi: And again this is one of the fundamental disagreements that we agree to disagree (White: it is) from our perspective, from our perspective, it’s an element of arrogance to say I am going to enter heaven and I’m certain about it. Rather, I’m very hopeful that I’m optimistic…