Responding to a list of questions published in the paper by Mr Scalfari, who is not a Roman Catholic, Francis wrote: “You ask me if the God of the Christians forgives those who don’t believe and who don’t seek the faith. I start by saying – and this is the fundamental thing – that God’s mercy has no limits if you go to him with a sincere and contrite heart. The issue for those who do not believe in God is to obey their conscience.
“Sin, even for those who have no faith, exists when people disobey their conscience.”
According to the paper, Robert Mickens, the Vatican correspondent for the Catholic journal, The Tablet, said that Francis' comments were more proof of his attempt to make the religion more relevant instead of fusty, yet somehow he also claims Francis is still conservative. Apparently, according to Mickens, he wants to have "a more meaningful dialogue with the world."
There is so much wrong with this its hard to know where to begin.
First I'll say that Francis speaks in line with the universalism of Rome, which is really at odds with its history and the rest of its dogmas, not the least of which is the repeated claim that to be outside of the RCC is to not be saved. Its a fine example of Rome speaking out of both sides of its mouth. But at the end of the day, the most consistent teaching officially is that only those in the Roman Catholic Church (RCC)are saved.
According to the Vatican's current catechism , the official teaching of the church, the Council of Trent is still in force and validated:
Prologue of RCC
Catechism #9 "The ministry of catechesis draws ever fresh energy from the
councils. The Council of Trent is a noteworthy example of this. It gave
catechesis priority in its constitutions and decrees. It lies at the origin of
the Roman Catechism, which is also known by the name of that council and which
is a work of the first rank as a summary of Christian teaching.
[12] The Council of Trent initiated a remarkable organization of
the Church's catechesis. Thanks to the work of holy bishops and theologians
such as St. Peter Canisius, St. Charles Borromeo, St. Turibius of Mongrovejo or
St. Robert Bellarmine, it occasioned the publication of numerous catechisms.
Here is what the Council of Trent says:
Trent Council CANON V.-If any one saith, that baptism is free, that is, not necessary unto salvation; let him be anathema.
The Catechism also states that salvation is found in the RCC alone:
RCC 846 Basing itself on Scripture and Tradition, the Council teaches that the Church, a pilgrim now on earth, is necessary for salvation...Hence they could not be saved who, knowing that the Catholic Church was founded as necessary by God through Christ, would refuse either to enter it or to remain in it.
This is a historic view of Rome. Its why the RCC persecuted biblical Christians for centuries.
So how can one be outside the sole source of salvation and yet to go Heaven? It makes zero sense. Its doublespeak.
Yet Bendict reiterated this dogma, as MSNBC reported:
But here is where Francis can stay in line with the catechism:
RCC #847
Those who, through no fault of their own, do not know the Gospel of Christ or
his Church, but who nevertheless seek God with a sincere heart, and, moved by
grace, try in their actions to do his will as they know it through the dictates
of their conscience - those too may achieve eternal salvation.
Its this biblical?
What the Bible says sin is:
(Remember, the Law is God's Word; "what is right" is according to Scripture.)
1Jn 3:4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.
1Jn 3:4 Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; and sin is lawlessness.
Jas 2:9 But if you show partiality, you are committing sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. 10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all.
Jas 4:17 Therefore, to one who knows the right thing to do and does not do it, to him it is sin.
Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death. 16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.
Rom 3:10 as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE;11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;12 ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."
Rom 3:19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.
Jas 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is carried away and enticed by his own lust. 15 Then when lust has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and when sin is accomplished, it brings forth death. 16 Do not be deceived, my beloved brethren.
Rom 3:10 as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE;11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;12 ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE."
Rom 3:19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.
Mat 22:36 "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the Law?"
Mat 22:37 And He said to him, " 'YOU SHALL LOVE THE LORD YOUR GOD WITH ALL YOUR HEART, AND WITH ALL YOUR SOUL, AND WITH ALL YOUR MIND.'
Mat 22:38 "This is the great and foremost commandment.
Mat 22:39 "The second is like it, 'YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.'
Mat 22:40 "On these two commandments depend the whole Law and the Prophets."
Basically sin is to break God's law. Even just one. It includes not doing what is required and also doing what is prohibited. Literally sin is "missing the mark". Its to fall short of God's glory, to be less holy than He is, to be imperfect. God says we are all unrighteous and have no good in us. Therefore we are all guilty of sin.
Is the conscience (heart/mind) a high enough standard to determine if one is in sin and thus if one will go to Heaven? Does God see that standard as good enough?
What the Bible Says About The Heart and Mind ("Conscience")
Psa 14:1 For the choir director. A Psalm of David. The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God." They are corrupt, they have committed abominable deeds; There is no one who does good.
Pro 12:15 The way of a fool is right in his own eyes, But a wise man is he who listens to counsel.
Pro 21:2 Every man's way is right in his own eyes, But the LORD weighs the hearts. 3 To do righteousness and justice Is desired by the LORD more than sacrifice. 4 Haughty eyes and a proud heart, The lamp of the wicked, is sin.
All are sinners and dead toward God: our hearts are desperately wicked:
Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned-- 13 for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the offense of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Eph 2:1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. 3 Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest.
Is. 64: 6 All of us have become like one who is unclean, and
all our righteous acts are like filthy rags; we all shrivel up like a leaf,
Jer. 17: 9 The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?
Perhaps Francis is referring to Romans 2 about the law of God written on the hearts of Gentiles. Still, the context makes it clear that God's standard is the same for all people:
Rom 2:5 But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,
Rom 2:6 who WILL RENDER TO EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS:
Rom 2:7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
Rom 2:8 but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation.
Rom 2:9 There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek,
Rom 2:10 but glory and honor and peace to everyone who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
Rom 2:11 For there is no partiality with God.
Rom 2:12 For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law;
Rom 2:13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified.
Justification:
Is the conscience (heart/mind) a high enough standard to determine if one is in sin and thus if one will go to Heaven? Does God see that standard as good enough?
What the Bible Says About The Heart and Mind ("Conscience")
What is "right" for those who don't have faith in God? Is it a holy standard? No, its the epitome of
selfishness and unholiness:
selfishness and unholiness:
Psa 14:1 For the choir director. A Psalm of David. The fool has said in his heart, "There is no God." They are corrupt, they have committed abominable deeds; There is no one who does good.
Pro 12:15 The way of a fool is right in his own eyes, But a wise man is he who listens to counsel.
Pro 21:2 Every man's way is right in his own eyes, But the LORD weighs the hearts. 3 To do righteousness and justice Is desired by the LORD more than sacrifice. 4 Haughty eyes and a proud heart, The lamp of the wicked, is sin.
Rom. 1: 21 For although they knew God, they
neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became
futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they
claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory
of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and
animals and reptiles.
Rom. 1: 28 Furthermore, since they did not
think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a
depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29 They have
become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They
are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice.
All are sinners and dead toward God: our hearts are desperately wicked:
Rom 5:12 Therefore, just as through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned-- 13 for until the Law sin was in the world, but sin is not imputed when there is no law. 14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the offense of Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come.
Rom 6:23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Rom 10:3 For, being ignorant of the righteousness that
comes from God, and seeking to establish their own, they did not submit to
God's righteousness. 4 For Christ is the end of the law for
righteousness to everyone who believes.
Col 1:21 And you, who once were alienated and
hostile in mind, doing evil deeds,
Jer. 17: 9 The heart is deceitful above all things and beyond cure. Who can understand it?
Rom. 8: 7 the sinful mind is hostile
to God. It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. 8 Those
controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God
1Co 2:14 The natural person DOES
NOT ACCEPT the things of the Spirit of God, for
they are FOLLY to him, and he is NOT ABLE to UNDERSTAND them because they
are spiritually discerned.
Mat 5:20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes
and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
they are FOLLY to him, and he is NOT ABLE to UNDERSTAND them because they
are spiritually discerned.
Mat 5:20 "For I say to you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the scribes
and Pharisees, you will not enter the kingdom of heaven.
Perhaps Francis is referring to Romans 2 about the law of God written on the hearts of Gentiles. Still, the context makes it clear that God's standard is the same for all people:
Rom 2:5 But because of your stubbornness and unrepentant heart you are storing up wrath for yourself in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,
Rom 2:6 who WILL RENDER TO EACH PERSON ACCORDING TO HIS DEEDS:
Rom 2:7 to those who by perseverance in doing good seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life;
Rom 2:8 but to those who are selfishly ambitious and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, wrath and indignation.
Rom 2:9 There will be tribulation and distress for every soul of man who does evil, of the Jew first and also of the Greek,
Rom 2:10 but glory and honor and peace to everyone who does good, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.
Rom 2:11 For there is no partiality with God.
Rom 2:12 For all who have sinned without the Law will also perish without the Law, and all who have sinned under the Law will be judged by the Law;
Rom 2:13 for it is not the hearers of the Law who are just before God, but the doers of the Law will be justified.
Rom 2:14 For when Gentiles who do not have the Law do instinctively the things of the Law, these, not having the Law, are a law to themselves,
Here's what John Gill says in regard to Rom. 2:14
"The objection of the Gentiles against their condemnation, taken from their being without the law, is here obviated. The apostle owns that they had not the law, that is, the written law of Moses, and yet intimates that they had, and must have a law, against which they sinned, and so deserved punishment, and which they in part obeyed; for these men"
"The matter and substance of the moral law of Moses agrees with the law and light of nature; and the Gentiles in some measure, and in some sort, did these things by nature; not that men by the mere strength of nature without the grace of God, can fulfill the law, or do anything that is acceptable to God; and indeed, what these men did was merely natural and carnal, and so unacceptable to God "
Justification:
And this touches on a very important issue: justification. No one can go to Heaven without being first justified by the thrice Holy God. That means that God imputes the righteousness of Christ to the sinner (see Rom. 4) when he believes in Him, because the sinner has no righteousness. And imputed righteousness comes through faith in the Person and work of the Lord Jesus Christ:
Rom 4:2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God. 3 For what does the Scripture say? "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS." 4 Now to the one who works, his wage is not credited as a favor, but as what is due. 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.
Therefore, without faith, one will not be justified and nor saved. Salvation and eternal life are given ONLY in and through Christ Jesus:
Therefore, without faith, one will not be justified and nor saved. Salvation and eternal life are given ONLY in and through Christ Jesus:
Joh 3:3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God."
Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Joh 3:36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."
Joh 6:29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
Joh 6:29 Jesus answered and said to them, "This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent."
Joh 14:6 Jesus *said to him, "I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me.
Heb 11:6 And without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is and that He is a rewarder of those who seek Him.
Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED." 14 How then will they call on Him in whom they have not believed? How will they believe in Him whom they have not heard?
Repentance:
How about repentance? Can people be unrepentant and still be forgiven and have eternal life?
Luk 13:3 "I tell you, no, but unless you repent, you will all likewise perish.
Psa 7:11 God is a righteous judge, And a God who has indignation every day. 12 If a man does not repent, He will sharpen His sword; He has bent His bow and made it ready.
2Tim. 2: 19 Nevertheless, God’s solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: “The Lord knows those who are his,” and, … “Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness.”
2Tim. 2: 25 Those who oppose him he must gently
instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a
knowledge of the truth,
Acts 11:18 When
they heard this, they had no further objections and praised God, saying, “So
then, God has granted even the Gentiles repentance unto life.”Conclusion:
So, is faith necessary for salvation and forgiveness of sin?
Absolutely.
And the object of that faith MUST be the Jesus of Scripture, not a Roman Catholic, Muslim, Mormon, or American-Evangelicalized one.
Is the unbeliever's conscience and obedience to it enough to enter Heaven (the biblical Heaven, that is)?
No. Scripture clearly and repeatedly states that the mind/heart of all men are fallen, totally depraved, without any good in them. God says we are all born dead in our sins and trespasses because of Adam's imputed sin nature to us.
I'd like to add here that a very good picture of what a regenerated, saved, forgiven person looks like is given in the first part of the Sermon on the Mount:
Mat 5:3 "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
Mat 5:4 "Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted.
Mat 5:5 "Blessed are the gentle, for they shall inherit the earth.
Mat 5:6 "Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied.
Mat 5:7 "Blessed are the merciful, for they shall receive mercy.
Mat 5:8 "Blessed are the pure in heart, for they shall see God.
Mat 5:9 "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they shall be called sons of God.
Mat 5:10 "Blessed are those who have been persecuted for the sake of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.
This is all about salvation. Those who know they are poor or bankrupt at heart, in spirit, mourn over that sin.
What Francis of the Vatican and the RCC have ignored in such false statements is the necessity of repentance and justification by faith. These are key elements for salvation, all of which is a gift of God given to those whom He has chosen to save. Because man is totally depraved, without any good, we can never work our way into Heaven. In fact all our best works are as filthy menstrual rags to God and thus wholly unacceptable.
Salvation and eternal life are completely on God's terms, not Rome's. It's a lie what Rome has declared and God will not let them go without giving them their due justice for lying and misrepresenting Him and His Word.
Eze 13:7 "Did you not see a false vision and speak a lying divination when you said, 'The LORD declares,' but it is not I who have spoken?"'" 8 Therefore, thus says the Lord GOD, "Because you have spoken falsehood and seen a lie, therefore behold, I am against you," declares the Lord GOD.
Isa 48:22 "There is no peace for the wicked," says the LORD.
Isa 57:20 But the wicked are like the tossing sea, For it cannot be quiet, And its waters toss up refuse and mud. 21 "There is no peace," says my God, "for the wicked."
Here's a good synopsis on such deception, by John MacArthur:
A Deceptive Illusion of Eternal Life
Notice that the broad way leading to destruction is not marked as the way to hell--it's marked as the way to heaven! People get on the broad road because it doesn't require a change of life-style. You simply have to say you made a decision, were baptized, went forward at a meeting, or signed a card. The sad thing is that many people are on that road. But the way that leads to life is restrictive, and very few find it.
If you still cling to your worldliness and self-righteousness, you're on the wrong road. You may think you're headed to heaven and that your good works will get you in. But someday you will discover what John Bunyan described in The Pilgrim's Progress : that there is an entrance to hell from the portals of heaven. In fact Christ warned people to beware of false prophets (Matt. 7:15-20) because they sell tickets to the broad way; they'll tell you you can get to heaven without changing anything.
In Matthew 7:21-22 Jesus says, "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven, but he that doeth the will of my Father, who is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? And in thy name have cast out demons? And in thy name done many wonderful works? And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you; depart from me, ye that work iniquity." Many people won't discover until it's too late that they were on the wrong road.
Christ concluded the Sermon on the Mount by illustrating the destinations of the broad and narrow roads. InMatthew 7:24-25 He speaks of a wise man who builds his house on a solid foundation. Verse 25 says, "The rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat upon that house, and it fell not; for it was founded upon a rock." That man came to God on His terms--he built his house on the rock, which is obedience. Therefore his house stood. Christ continues, "Every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, who built his house upon the sand" (v. 26). The foolish man built a beautiful house; his religion looked good. He is one of those who prophesied, cast out demons, and did wonderful works (v. 22) but never came to God on His terms. Verse 27 says, "The rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat upon that house, and it fell; and great was the fall of it."
What a disaster it would be to come before Christ on Judgment Day and discover you are sentenced to hell because you didn't come to Him His way! Examine yourself to see whether you are in the faith. As Peter said, "Be all the more diligent to make certain about His calling and choosing you" (2 Peter 1:10 ; New American Standard Bible ).
End quote. (bold, red, mine)
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